tv Charlie Rose The Week PBS June 24, 2016 11:30pm-12:01am PDT
>> rose: welcome to the program. i'm charlie rose. the program is "charlie rose: the week." just ahead, britain votes to leave the european union. the supreme court deadlocks over immigration reform. is and a historic broadway musical is paid homage in shuffle along. >> rose: we will have those stories and more about what happened and what might happen. >> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by:
>> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications >> rose: and so you began how? >> joyous rage. >> rose: is it luck at all or is it something else? well, that's the million-dollar question. >> rose: what's the object lesson here? >> it requires cooperation. >> rose: tell me the the significance of the moment. >> rose: of this the week the people of britain voted to leave the european union. the congress grappled with gun control. and the cleveland cavaliers delivered that city its first championship title in 52 years. here are the sights and sounds of the past seven days. >> hillary clinton may be the most corrupt person ever to seek the presidency. >> he's going after me personally because he has no answers on the substance. ( applause ) >> rose: the supreme court upholds affirmative action. >> the university affirmative
action upheld by the u.s. supreme court. the justices voting 4-3. >> the supreme court dealing a big blow to president obama's plan to block deportation for undocumented ipgrant. >> i think it is heartbreaking for the millions of imgrant who make their lives here. >> an officer was acquitted in the murder of freddie gray. >> it was a packed courtroom and a very tense courtroom. >> three people tried to get into new york with a van full of loaded weapons. >> rose: democrats shut down the house. >> we will occupy this floor. >> this isn't trying to come up with a solution to a problem. this is trying to get attention. >> rose: cleveland comes back to take the n.b.a. title. >> it's over! it's over! cleveland is a city of champions once again. ♪ bye-bye love >> the british people have voted to leave the european union. >> this is a difficult moment for both side. >> it's a victory against the big merchant banks, against the big businesses, and against big
politics. >> rose: led zeppelin wins in a california court. >> a jury in america has just ruled that led zeppelin did not steal the famous chords of "stairway to heaven." >> the artist cristoses floating pier make a splash in italy. >> they say you walk across and it feels like you are on a rocking poet. >> rose: we begin the week with the historic news out of britain-- would they say or would they go? we now have the answer by a 52-48 margin. the british people voted thursday to leave the european union. the results have already caused prime minister david cameron to resign, rig nighted scotland's independence movement, and upset world financial markets. for more we turn to our panel. >> people were sick and tired of having 60% of their laws made in
brussels and all the judges appointed by foreigners who were going to decide on the the legality of those laws and decided to take back our independence. >> rose: is that why you supported it so hopeful? >> oh, totally, yes, absolutely. i never expected today would ever happen in my lifetime so i'm completely thrilled it has. >> rose: david? >> i think it's a very sad day for britain. i think it's a very bad day, obviously, for europe because this isn't the end of the story. and i think it does speak to a real indictment of the political leadership center right and center left, that has clearly lost the confidence of a lot of the public. and the fact that the campaign was defined as a revolt against experts, a revolt against reason. >> rose: john? >> i'm afraid i'm in the sad and bad category as well. i agree with that. i think we're now going to have quick divorce as quickly asdo.
possible. and on the other side you have the british saying, no, we want time. it is highly likely nothing will begin until after october. they probably won't file article 50 until then. when it start, then it's two years from then. so you have a very long period of uncertainty, and during that period, that is exactly what markets hate. >> david what, do you think? >> so i think the real worry now for the leaders of whatever british government emerges out of this is the british people have sent a very clear signal. they've given a mandate for something that hasn't happen. if you look at sunderland, voted early, sent shock waves through the international market, singlehandedly plunged the pound. they are home to a nissan plant making japanese cars which can be sold freely in the european market. so voters i suspect saying they want an end to foreigners, particularly europeans, having free movement into the companied k., but they certainly want to carry on selling their cars in
europe as before. they want the same prosperity and free trade as before but not free movement of workers and i don't think they can have both, and i don't think any politician, including boris johnson of the brexit campaign, can deliver that for them now. >> rose: in domestic politics this week, donald trump turned up the heat in the presidential race. in a speech wednesday, he said, "hillary clinton may be the most corrupt person ever to seek the presidency of the united states." the fiery turn and rhetoric came amid news that the campaign is reportedly facing major financial issues. and earlier this week, trumped fired his campaign manager. our panel has more. >> they're trying to paint themselves as the change candidate, whereas hillary clinton is the status quo candidate, the worst pol-- the
worst of politics, the worst of washington, somebody who is only going to make things worse north change anything. and this is what they believe is going to be able to potentially turn over independents to their side, bernie sanders supporters -- you heard them make an appeal to bernie sanders supporters -- and who they believe are soft democrats who may not like hillary clinton. >> rose: have you seen anything like this? >> i wasn't around for the teddy roosevelt rematch in 1912. this is certainly going to be the lincoln-douglas debates. it will be more like the fights, and before we're over with this there will be two of the most unpopular candidates running for president. >> rose: will it come down to who can make a referendum to the other? >> i'm sure it is. the critical thing is does he have the resources in the next three or four weeks, which is very critical. they're going to try to define him with $20 million, $30 million in negative advertising,
do what we do with john kerry with the efforts of bush and do what they did the last time with romney. >> rose: in both cases they did it before the convention. >> this is a very important time. >> this is a key period right now. i think he's got no financial resources. he's got no organization. he doesn't clearly have the performance down, meaning every other-- every third or fourth day in his general day-to-day performance he says something that set the campaign back. it's hard for me-- if we were in january or february, it would be one thing. we're almost in july. the the idea in the next few months that he can pull this together, i'm highly skeptical. >> rose: they're really going for the kill right now to do what in fact was done to mitt romney and do what was done to-- >> that's absolutely fair to say. the trump campaign knows this. the the staffers behind the scene know this. there's a problem rehaig that message to donald trump himself. the family knows this. they have been trying to tell him this over and over again. the recent drop in polls was a real wake-up call for him that things need to change. is he going to be able to
change? well, that's the million-dollar question. >> rose: the supreme court handed down five decisions this week, two of which will affect large numbers of minorities. in the first, the court upheld affirmative action, which has long benefitted minority applicants to colleges and universities. but in the second, the court ama's controversialsident immigration reforms. adam liptack say supreme court correspondent for the "new york times." >> the effect of this 4-4 tie was to leave in place a federal appeals court decision that blocks the program and it effectively ends any chance of reviving the program while president obama is in office and raises real questions about whether this immigration overhaul will ever come into being. even as the court did almost nothing and set no supreme court precedent, it had enormous practical cons againsts. >> rose: and for his legacy it is what?
>> it's a real setpack for him. it's something that the administration felt can confident wasful. loswas lawful. thought they had a shot in the supreme court and ended up with a 4-4 deadlock. >> rose: so what can they do now, nothing? >> well, the case will go on in the the lower courts, and sooner it might find its way back to the supreme court, but that will attack a year or two. and a lot can happen in the meantime. but it may be that eventually a nine-member supreme court with either hillary clinton or donald trump appointee on it will have another look at this question. esident obama has left office. yes. there seems to be nothing or vanishingly little that can be done before november. >> rose: let me turn to affirmative action. what's the historic significance of that decision? >> this is big. this is a 4-3 decision upholding an affirmative action plan at the university of texas, written by justice kennedy, who has
basically been a skeptic of affirmative action, has never before voted to uphold an affirmative action plan, and the basic message of the decision is that it's okay. ce as one factor among many inof deciding whom to admit to their colleges and universities. this is done. this is over. this is something that will be with us for a long time, this thick that university admissions officials say they really need and want is something the supreme court has now said they can do. >> rose: we turn now to gun control. it has been playing out on capitol hill all week. beginning on wednesday, democrats conducted a 24-hour sit-in, demanding the house vote. speaker paul ryan recessed the house without taking those votes. karl holtz, of the "new york times" has been following the story. is the assessment now that the
democrats helped their case because of this? i think they helped their case publicly with the public, and, honestly, with themselves, you know. they were happy that they took on this challenge. i think they got a lot of attention, but i don't think they're going to get a measure through the house. ryan was pretty clear. it got voted down in committee earlier. i don't think that's going anywhere. and i don't think that republicans are going to be in a mood to give them more of what they want. they don't want to reward this. i think it's going to continue to be a confrontation. >> rose: and the republicans did not evaporate to have a vote simply because they did not want to be on record in a heated atmosphere after orlando? >> i think republicans, they voted pretty overwhelmingly in the committee to reject this. i think there are a lot of republicans who wouldn't mind taking this vote and in some ways people on the hill saying the speaker might have defueled this earlier if he had let people do it. most of these guys are pretty clear about their progun stance. i don't know that they'll give
it to them now after this. there are going to be a lot of bad feelings over this. >> rose: what will it change in terms oaf will it change and somehow make the house, if it could possibly be, more fractious? >> yeah, i think it could do that. there were a lot of republicans-- this is congress. majorities don't like to see their majority sort of taken away by the minority through tactics like this. you know, there were a lot of people who were pretty mad about it. yeah, i don't think it's going to increase comedy, as they say, in the house. no, i think there's going to be further fallout, but i think democrats are happy. they're going-- they know they can't win this vote in the house anyway, so they might as well push it and make a scene. and that's what they did and they were happy about it. >> rose: where does the susan collins pill stand? >> so the collins bill was interesting. in a way she won. she got 52 votes. she got a majority not to table her bill to use the senate
parliamentary parlance. and she probably would have 54 votes, which would have been the most of any this week. but dianne feinstein and bernie sanders weren't there today. she's got 54 vote. it looks good in a way. they didn't kill it. but it's going nowhere right now. she has to get to 60 and show she can produce 60 votes. it was a very interesting vote. there was old-fashioned armtwisting on the floor going on as susan collins, ellie ayotte, and others to try to convince some of the republican colleagues to get on board. dan coates, is one. he ended up voting with them. she didn't lose, but victory is a ways away. lindsey graham, who has voted with susan collins and is pretty outspoang, he's willing to break from the n.r.a. a little bit. he said what could make a movement is another terrorist attack. it's that sort of thing. i think that, you know, it's just there for a while, and it's-- but it's not moving.
it's not moving at this point. >> rose: joe biden is the 47th vice president of the united states and twice a candidate for the democratic nomination for president. as a senator, he twice served as a chairman of the senate committee on foreign affairs. this week, he delivered a key speech on foreign policy. it was highly critical of donald trump's approach to international affairs-- notably, his attacks on islam. i sat down with the vice president in washington shortly after his speech on monday. >> there's 1.5 billion muslims in the world. if we make the religion the enemy, where the hell do you think we're going to get the cooperation? >>. >> rose: but is that what donald trump is doing, in your judgment? >> yes. >> rose: so if you were running against him, you like political battle. you like the battle of ideas.
what would be your case? what would be your campaign? >> it's a different world, charlie. it's one thing and we have to continue to be worried about major regional actors-- russia, china, others, iran-- but what people are most worried about are the stateless actors, those elements from failed state that are generating extremist ideologies and organizations. that is not met with a standing army. that is met with an intensive interlocking of intelligence organizations, willingness to train those governments and those countrieses that in fact are trying to establish themselves the first time with the capacity to deal internally with these extremist elements. that all requires cooperation. what good does it do if fallujah
is free and ramadi is freed and cleared, and the devastation left behind in those sunni towns, we don't help rebuild those towns. another extremist group will pop up. so what are we doing? we can't pay for all of it ourselves. so we're going to donors. we're convincing the japanese, you know, the europeans and others, help rebuild those towns. help rebuild them. so you can provide some stability. help train the forces in iraq and other places to be able to deal with this kind of extremism. as i said and everybody laughed, but tom friedman, who i think is pretty good, a good friend, he wrote a long time ago, if you don't visit a bad neighborhood, it will eventually visit you. >> rose: there are those who argue, look, we've had a problem ke mubarak and gaddafi andrs like saddam, and it's come back, and we might ask the question
would we have been better off if they stayed? >> let's take libya. >> rose: saddam, gaddafi, mubarak? >> absolutely. i argued strongly against going -- >> to libya. >> to libya. my question was, okay, tell me what happens? he's gone. what happens? doesn't the country disintegrate? what happens then? doesn't it become a place where it becomes a petri dish for the growth of extremism? tell me. tell me what we're going to do. >> rose: and it has. >> and it has. >> rose: and isil is pouring in people to build a stronger force. >> yeah. and so, so, look, i mean, i think-- here's the thing i am-- charlie, i don't think we should use force unless it meets certain basic criteria. is it in the national security of the united states? are our interests directly threatened, number one-- our or
allies? number two, can we use it efficaciously, will it work? and number three, can it be sustained? now i can take you to any part of the world and put in two, 300,000, or 150,000 troops. we can absolutely end the carnage but we're there. my dad used to have an compression. he'd say, "joey if everything is equally important to you, nothing is important to you." tell me, what are our greatest concerns in terms of our existential existence? well, i would argue whether pakistan collapses as a nuclear state. whether or not north korea decides to use nuclear weapons. whether or not china decides to become rogue, and they're not now. whether russia continues to challenge borders in europe. they are existential concerns. is it a concern that there is a bad guy in africa or in the middle east? yes. it is a concern. but what is within our
wheelhouse to do? and can we solve every problem around the world? and so i think we don't often ask enough, and we didn't ask enough in the beginning, about okay, i know what the first step is and the second step. what's the third and fourth steps. >> rose: is that the fear you have in syria today? >> yes. yes. >> rose: you don't know if you-- if you take out assad, you do not know what will follow. >> that's part of it. but, by the way, to take out assad now, you're talking on russia and iran. russia has significant amount of firepower this. russia has imposed a radar system that coferredz a significant portion-- covers a significant portion of the country. you're going noog and take out the russian facilities? you're going to take out and take on russian aircraft there? we can do it. we will succeed. but can we do it.
>> rose: i have taken way more time. your entire staff will hate me. bubut you told me i could take s much as i want. >> you're the best. an actual conversation, and i appreciate that. >> rose: thank you, mr. vice president. >> rose: noo in 1921, the largely fordpoant musical "shuffle along" premiered on broadway. it was one of the first hit shows to be act, written and directed by african americanss. now a new broadway musical called "shuffle along, or the making of the musical sensation in 1921, and all that followed" pays homage to the original. it was nominated for 10 tony awards. it was written and directed by george c. wolf, and choreographed by savon gloverrer. >> the most challenging thing about creating a musical is
making sure the buoyancy maintains no matter what. even when you have something like anytime west side story" or "sweeney todd" the energy of buoyancy has to push it all the way through. all the way to the curtain. there is a story that huby blake tells that george gershwin lifted the note of "i got rhythm" from a pit player after sheeg "shuffle along." he lifted those notes and he stole them. i'm not saying what he did. i'm not saying that he didn't. >> rose: somebody said it. >> huby plac said it. it became an interesting thing. and it becomes a tap dance that savon choreographed of him playing the instrument, and him dancing out the fact in theory somebody lifted his notes. and he becomes-- gilbert said "shuffle along" is filled with joyous rage and this number becomes a manifestation of that.
>> rose: how about this? this is from chris jones writing in "the chicago tribune": >> it's extraordinary. it's an extraordinary statement. when i first met with odd real estate mcdonald they asked her to join the show. i told her, you and i have come along at this time where we have extraordinary options. these people had none so they had to carve out one. and their expagz their joy, and their love and their defiance were the weapons that they used to carve out this space. and they created something that was so extraordinary and something that was celebrated. and then it went away. and then it went away.
the show was so popular at the time, that fanny bryce went to the producers and begged them to add a wednesday midnight show so that everybody else on broadway could come see it. >> rose: is this something you just dived into and said, "man, i gotta find out everything? i gotta learn everything? i got to really get engaged by this?" >> not only by the show but the invitation. >> rose: you mean it's a big deal to work for george wolf? >> it's sort of if he calls you might want to answer. ( laughter ) it was just a matter of me wanting to just be gak of back in the room with him -- >> be in the room? >> yeah, be in the room and learn and work and have fun, whatever it was going to be, i knew it was going to be successful within. and i'm just proud -- >> so he was right by not letting you perform in the beginning. >> to be determined. ( laughter )
>> rose: sheer a look at the week ahead: sunday is new york city's pride march. monday is the the first day of the 130th wimbledon tennis championship. tuesday is comedian mel brook's 90th birthday. wednesday is the day president obama attends the the north american leadership summit. thursday is the day the 25th rim pacific naval exercise will be held in the hawaiian islands. friday is the weigh-in for the annual nathan's 4th of july international hot dog eating contest on new york's coney island. saturday is the start of the 103 tour de france bicycle race. and here is what's new for your weekend. matthew mcconaughey in theaters in the civil war drama "free state of jones." >> last time i checked, a gun don't care who was pulling the
trigger. >> rose: cameron crow's new series premieres on showtime on sunday. >> it's my opinion in life you need two things to survive-- oxygen and family. >> rose: and the annual dplafton bury music festival runs all weekend in hilton, england. ♪ and i won't let this moment pass us by pass us boy ♪ >> rose: that's "charlie rose: the week" for this week. on behalf of all of us here, thank you for watching. i'm charlie rose. we'll see you next time. funding for charlie rose was provided by the following:
>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin this evening with the incredible results in great britain on the brexit vote. britain elected to leave the european union and we talk with that with john micklethwait, david miliband, david rennie and andrew roberts. >> it's a sad day for britain, it's a very bad day for europe because this isn't the end of the story and i think it speaks to a real indictment of the political leadership center right and left who's clearly lost a lot of confidence of the public and the fat of the campaign was defined as a revolt against experts and reason. the unanimity of economic opinion, widespread, other expert opinion speaks, i think, to the fundamental condition of our politics